Transcript: The First 100 Days of a New Employee (EP85)

 

Intro (with music): Welcome to The Culture of Things podcast with Brendan Rogers. This is a podcast where we talk all things, culture, leadership and teamwork across business and sport.

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Brendan: This is my conversation with Marc Reifenrath.

Marc is the Co-Founder & CEO of Spinutech.

Spinutech has grown from a University Dorm start-up over 20 years ago to a multinational digital agency with 150+ team members across the U.S.

Marc is the epitome of leadership.

He’s completely focused on serving the needs of his people. He knows, by helping them be the best they can be, they’ll take care of the business.

Sure, by his own admission at the end of the interview, he’s not perfect. Nobody is!

Today we focus on the first 100 days of a new employee at Spinutech. You’ll get some fantastic ideas you could implement to improve your new employees' experience. 

Have you ever worked for a company and a leader that was so good you hoped to retire there?

That’s how employees feel at Spinutech.

Check out my three key takeaways after the interview.

We love feedback. Let us know what you liked or didn’t like and we’ll keep improving.

This is The Culture of Things podcast. I’m Brendan Rogers. 

Sit back and enjoy my conversation with Marc.

Brendan: Marc, why are the first 100 days for a new employee so important? 

Marc: I think the first 100 days is just an absolutely critical goal for setting the tone of what their career and what their journey at Spinutech is going to be. I think injecting the DNA of our culture and our core values into that new team member as quickly as possible, building loyalty, learning how their teammates interact with them, what their skill sets are, and how they handle pressure, it's all of those things to really get them to be the best version of themselves in our environment as they can possibly be. 

Brendan: Mate, you've grown Spinutech from nothing to something pretty substantial, I have to say. At what point did the realization in the first 100 days come in for you that it was so important for new employees? 

Marc: We've been around for 22 years. It started when I was in college, so there was no thought of the first 100 days, there was no thought of onboarding for quite a while. As we started to scale up and hire more than a couple people a year. Maybe we’re hiring 15 people a year, 30 people a year, or 40 people a year, you start to think about those things and experience that you're curating for a new team member. 

Probably about four or five years ago, I would say, is when it really became something we thought we should formalize. Over the last couple of years, it's really gotten refined and I would say in a really tight spot for us where we know exactly what's happening, when, and who's doing it. It's a very consistent experience for that new team member. 

I believe it creates a lot of opportunities for retention in this environment and really just helps them feel like they made the right choice because I think we live in a pretty uncertain time. It's hard to make change, although we all want change. Anybody who's starting a new journey like that, they're questioning themselves, did I make the right decision? We need to make sure that they're reassured that they did make the right decision. Really, in the last two to four years, it has evolved and really tightened up to being a really solid process for us. 

Brendan: It sounds like on that journey, you and those new employees have had the chance of experiencing maybe what a bad first 100 days look like. Tell us a bit of detail around that. 

Marc: I know that a lot of our team members have because we get a lot of feedback on how great our process is. I don't know that I can really compare it, aside from what we used to do or maybe what we didn't use to do. 

It was baptism by fire, drinking out of a fire hose. All right, there's your desk. Here's your equipment. I'm Marc, this is so and so, this is so and so, and you just kind of throw them into the fire. That was the first year 10 for sure. There wasn't really a process. There wasn't really a great experience. I think it is so critical, and so having maybe for us evolved and knowing that that's the version I have of it. 

You do hear stories from people of, wow, I didn't know that somebody could care so much about my first day, even identifying that first 100 days. I'm in the YPL, Young Presidents Organization, and this topic had come up in one of my forums that I'm in and we were thinking about this, but that maybe pushed it and maybe raised the bar to a whole other level as well. That was because a lot of those leaders had seen or realized they had a bad experience. 

The other thing I would say is in today's market, it is a differentiator. You need to have that edge over other employers and other businesses because there are a lot of options for people and this is just one more thing that can set you apart.

Brendan: Before we dive into the, I guess the breakup of what's been your take doing that first 100 days, can you just clarify what's the responsibility of the, can I say reporting leader or reporting manager, for the new person? What's that key responsibility for them in that first 100 days? 

Marc: They're kind of their main point. I would say they kind of own the relationship, but there are several other people checking in or part of that process. There may be a consistent voice for that because that's really what happens. The reason for that is because they're the most consistent thing post 100 days as well. Whether that's a weekly check-in that first 100 days, we also assign a mentor that is typically not on that team that has been with Spinutech for more than a year. That leader is really just the consistency throughout the process, I would say. 

Brendan: You've shared the responsibility of the reporting manager leader. What responsibility does the employee take, particularly in those first 100 days?

Marc: This is something I think has changed in the last couple of years with COVID because when you were in the office, it was easier because there was human interaction face to face. I've been challenging every new team member today that we have a great process and you need to be engaged. Engagement is obviously one thing, but you have to lean in just as much as we're leaning in as a company to really make this work in this hybrid or remote environment. 

That means reaching out to people that are on your team on your own. Don't wait for them to reach out to you. It means setting up a virtual coffee or virtual lunch with a random team member that isn't on your team. 

I would say, recreating those happy collisions that used to happen in the office when we were walking to and from meetings to lunch, coming into the office building at the same time, those things aren't happening now. We are not walking into meetings. We are running late to every Zoom call, Google Hangout, or whatever you're on and quickly getting off. 

There's no, hey, Brendan. How was your weekend? What did you do this weekend? Did you see the game? Did you take that hike you were talking about? Did you go fishing? Slack does a little bit of that, but it really requires every team member, not just new ones, to lean in a little bit more to recreate some of the in-office things that we used to have. 

Brendan: Great points. Absolutely being deliberate around those things. Let's break into or dive into the 100 days for Spinutech. To give some context around that, as an overview, how do you break up the first 100 days? 

Marc: The first 100 days technically start when the day one of employment begins. Our process is probably more like a 115-day process because pre-employment, once they sign and accept an offer, they've got some paperwork. We send a lot of that typical HR stuff ahead of time and let them get that out of the way. 

We figure out what they need from an equipment perspective. We send them swag so they get that swag ahead of time. They have everything they need to start day one and are ready to go. It's really that pre-start, then it's the first 30 days, then we go into that two to six months range, and then post-six months. 

If you think of that first 30 days, that is probably the most critical piece of it, and then it kind of tapers off but still has those critical touch points throughout that process. There are really probably four steps—that pre-start, month one, two to six, and then beyond that six months or beyond that first 100 days. 

Brendan: What benefits or power do you find in that pre-start? Actually starting that connection and the experience with Spinutech before they've actually walked into the physical wall, so to speak, or even the virtual walls nowadays. 

Marc: I think it's an affirmation that they made the right choice. It makes them feel welcome. It makes them feel part of the team. They're loved. It's all positive. It helps build the excitement for that first day. 

We were talking before the interview about my kids starting school and there was excitement. JP, my oldest, was walking out saying, I wish school started tomorrow. We want them to have that feeling of I wish work started tomorrow instead of another week or whatever so that they have this energy, this vibe that they're bringing. One of our big things is we get better every day. That's one of our core values. 

Before you even start, you want that momentum, that feeling of, I want to show up and give it my best. If we're giving them our best and showing them that we're going to care for them, take care of them, love them, and give them everything they need to be successful, that just sets a different tone right away right out of the gate. 

Brendan: It sounds like in that prestart phase, that 15 days or so, there's a lot of logistics as you refer to a bit of HR, but is there anything in that phase that funnels that scenario that you're most proud of as far as I'm organization that really sets you apart? 

Marc: The swag is really cool because I don't think a lot of people get that ahead of time, but one thing that we are trying to do more of is what is a $20 or less indulgence that Brendan loves? It's a Snickers, it's a Starbucks gift card, but something that's maybe a little bit personalized to that individual. 

That's something you can pull on post 100 days as well. You had a rough week or you did a great job, that's an easy way to hit somebody with a very personalized experience. Again, it's less than $20, so it's not a big deal for anybody, but it has a bigger impact, a bigger value than the $5, $10, or whatever it is that you actually did for them. 

If they're not in the office, we would provide them a DoorDash or some type of meal option for day one so they have that ready to go so they can have that lunch with their manager and with their team virtually. We've got that already taken care of so they don't have to think about it and they can get, hopefully, their favorite restaurants, meal, or whatever. 

Brendan: You haven't got a job for just some old guy in Australia that loves talking to people, have you? 

Marc: Well, we can figure something out. 

Brendan: You're saying we've all got skills. 

Marc: Yeah, absolutely. Hey, listen, joking aside, what's the best thing you can do as an entrepreneur as you grow? It's to hire people smarter than you. I've become really good at it.

The bar is pretty low, but I think we've really excelled at hiring people that are just super talented. I always say culture fit is number one, but then if they've got that and they're good at something, it's our job to put them in the best seat to extrapolate. 

You're right, all of us have talents and we all see the world differently. As leaders, if we can figure that out as soon as possible, and in the interview process, we're probably not going to understand everything about Brendon, how you tick, and what motivates you. Are you a high fact finder? Are you a quick start? Where do you sit on some of those scales? 

Once we can figure that out and really make sure we're working and putting you in a position to do your best work as many hours of the day from a worker perspective as possible, that's good for both of us.

Brendan: As the business owner of Spinutech, what responsibility do you have, if any, in those first 15 days before they come physically into the environment? 

Marc: In the interview process, we're about 165 people today, I still try to—that's occasionally, I have some scheduling conflicts—but do the final interview. It's really just a 15–20 minutes kind of cultural gut check, as well as just showing them, hey, we're about to make an investment in you. I want you to feel very comfortable with this, and I want to give you the opportunity to ask me any question you want. 

You want to talk to me about culture? I'm going to show you how passionate I am about that. If you have a question about the direction of the company and where we're going and why, I want you to hear it directly from me. 

I ask one question, and that is what is your wake-up song when you wake up in the morning playing in your head every morning? It's just a fun one. There's no right or wrong answer, but I’m trying to set that tone of we can work hard and play hard together all at once, and let them know that I'm a human just like them. Don't come in with the societal expectations of a CEO or a leader. I'm in this battle with you and want to make you successful as best as possible. That's one part of it. 

The other part is ideally, day one, hopefully, week on, in the worst-case scenario, I'm going to spend an hour with each new team member doing a cultural and core values overview for onboarding. I heard a great leader at a conference probably 12 years ago say, if it was important to you, it should come from you. I really took that to heart after that conference and said, okay, what things do the team needs to hear from me that I care about? 

Most business owners' core values are going to be very tightly aligned with how they view their life and live their lives in general. These core values are very important to me, and it's easy for me to speak about them, not just reading them off the page, but telling them what are the details of that, and maybe giving some examples that we wouldn't necessarily share with the public but how we've lived them in tough moments or in moments of failure, moments of success, and challenging situations with a former teammate, with a former client, or an existing client and existing teammate. 

Just giving them that very real access to how we think about culture and how much we care about it and how much we care about our core values. Our core values. We have some simple rules. We hire, fire, lead, manage, and solve problems using our core values. Just setting that tone on day one, week one with that new team member is very important. 

My other goal is I don't want a yes when you accept. I want a hell yes. I also want you to have your absolute best first day you've ever had because somebody's going to ask you, your spouse, a friend, a parent, a neighbor, somebody, is going to say, hey, you started your new job today. How did it go?

As we've said, a lot of people have not great onboarding experience, so the bar is relatively low, but that's a moment to make a huge impression because we're all going to have bad days. If they remember how we cared for them and brought them into the team and show them how important they are to our success, it makes those bad days a little less bad or the aftertaste of that doesn't last as long. 

Brendan: You've hired me, tell me about what to expect on day one of coming into Spinutech. 

Marc: On day one, you're going to have some initial meetings with your leaders, we also have an onboarding specialist as well, so she would be walking you through setting up the schedule and everything. It's a lot of meet and greets with your leader, with your team. As I said, I'm hopefully going to be involved with that. 

We've got that lunch and kind of reviewing some of the schedules for what they're going to need to accomplish in that first week. It's relatively light. We try not to overdo it because it is very overwhelming for that new person. If you're looking at an eight-hour day, it might only be five hours of actual meetings with the team and leaving some space in between for them to kind of decompress and process what they've just heard. 

Brendan: I guess this changes with the role, but speaking generally about a new employee coming into your organization, what is the expectation (again generally) of them at the end of that first week? 

Marc: Engagement and then really kind of what questions should they be asking. We want curiosity, that's one of the things we really push is to ask questions and challenge the way we've done things. 

One thing that I try to set the tone on in that first onboarding is to be curious and ask why often. It's not that you should challenge, oh, you're doing it wrong, but my expectation for you is you have a very unique perspective, but that perspective is relatively quickly going to burn off. You have the way that you've always done something, the way that you are trained, and it's a unique perspective. We need to take advantage of that. 

We've done a great job for 22 years of constantly evolving and changing. It's not that we do a full sale change on a process, but it's, oh, Brendan had this idea or this feedback of hey, why don't you guys do that way? You made one little comment and it's like, you're right, we could totally change that. It makes that process a little bit better, a little bit more efficient, makes the experience better for whoever they're acting with or whatever. 

I really want to make sure we're extrapolating that prior experience in a positive way. I always also tell them, if you ever hear anybody say, well, that's the way we've always done it, I want you to let me know right away. That means that that process is absolutely 110% broken. 

It's really empowering them to be engaged and provide that feedback. We're not too proud to say that we're perfect and we want to hear that feedback and allow ourselves to truly get better. 

Brendan: Is there an experience or an example that sticks in your mind that a new employee has provided a suggestion that's really enhanced the process? 

Marc: I'm trying to think of a specific one. There's been lots of little stuff over the years and I would say sometimes, it's just also an affirmation that you're doing the right thing. Talking to a new team member and just having them say, wow, what an amazing experience, and sometimes in that, you might actually hear something that you didn't expect to come out of it that maybe makes you actually say, hey, I don't know if we're doing that every time or if that was intentional, but that clearly was a great thing. I love that they felt that. Let's make sure that every new team member feels that.

We've had maybe some people challenge, is it really that way? We talk a lot in the interview process about work-life balance and their feedback is, I didn't really believe you. Everybody says that in the interview process, and I'm like, what? You didn't trust us? You didn't believe us? It's kind of offensive because that's the way we really are. I'm naive, I think that everybody talks the truth. It makes you go, okay, if that's the way they were feeling, how do we maybe make sure that they know that's the truth? 

I actually would say some of the feedback we've gotten has maybe helped inform the hiring process before they're actually hired. We allow them to talk to multiple team members on purpose, which we want buy-in from the team. The beauty of it is they will tell me at the end, well, it's been really great because it's been very consistent. 

I asked about the same questions and I'm getting similar answers. I joke that, well, of course, we give them a script they have to read from, but obviously that would be impossible. It's so fun to have that validation that we're not faking this, that it is a lived culture, lived core values, and they're experiencing that. That was feedback that we learned from candidates as they became team members and just understanding their perspective from the other side of the table or the other side of the screen now in that interview process.

Brendan: What sort of feedback do you get specifically around your time with the new person, the new employee? You said you spent some time early on that final interview as much as possible. It sounds pretty consistent around that, but then the time in setting the scene, sharing core values, having those, and sharing those stories. 

Marc: The feedback that I've gotten both in the interview process. I think a lot of people are maybe a little bit surprised that I'm sitting in that room or on that screen with them. You get a lot of people to say, hey, thank you. I really appreciate that the CEO would take the time to sit with me. 

I make sure to say, listen, every hire is an important hire for us. If we let the wrong person through the door, that's a big problem for both parties. We want to invest that time because this is one of the biggest priorities for me to make sure we have the best talent, the best fit. 

Then even in that onboarding meeting, it's a lot of gratitude and thank you. Thank you for sharing this. It's a validation of what they heard in the interview process. It's good to get their feedback and their questions. 

I always tell them, listen, forget about what societal expectations they have of leadership. We're here together. You can reach out at any point in time. You know me. You know how I talk. You know that I use my hands a lot when I talk. I'm trying not to do as much on screen, but they know how animated I can get and the passion that they can feel, so don't be afraid to reach out like I'm a human. I put on my pants the same way you do. Just letting them know that it's okay. Don't have that fear. 

I started to notice as we got bigger and we were still in the office, especially the less experienced team members that were fresh out of college, it was intimidating for them to be in my presence at times. I'm not a very intimidating person. I'm tall, I'm 6'5", but I started to realize that it was more about the role that I had as opposed to maybe the way that I portrayed myself.

I was like, okay, we've got to change that. Nobody should be intimidated by any leader here. That's bad. You're breaking down communication before you even communicate it. Sometimes just tell people and also maybe if I'm sensing that from those individuals approaching them in a soft manner and building that relationship. 

With 165 people, it's also hard to have everybody know you like they did when I was smaller. The feedback generally is very good, which makes me feel good that it is a good investment of my time. Oftentimes I can pull on things I've learned in those meetings on that first day when I do meet them in person or when I'm in a meeting with them, I try to pick up on little things. 

Are they married, spouse and kids, sports, activities, or hobbies that they like. I know a few people that are into fishing or fly fishing or are they into golf? If I try to ping them on Slack, I try to pick a few people a week to just kind of casually check-in, I'll say like, hey, how's the little one doing, have you gone out to play golf lately, or have you caught any fish lately? Just to make them know that I do care about them and I'm listening. They're just not a butt in a seat. They're not a number. They're a big part of the team and a big part of the team's success.

Brendan: Marc, just for clarity's sake, your organization, I think you said about 165 as it stands currently. Is there a point where you think you won't be able to have that level of interaction, some of those things you've just explained? Does the business get too big?

Marc: I think that that's possible. Here's what I'll tell you that I think is an ego thing that a lot of leaders won't admit or don't want to go to the danger on. The success rate of founder to CEO is not great, especially the bigger you get. I have to be very self-aware as a leader of when maybe that is what I do and I hand the reins over to somebody else to do some of the other stuff that I'm doing as well.

Maybe that's when I do keep involved with that because that's what I'm really good at or what I'm really passionate about. I'm not saying that I'm close to that or that that's going to happen, but it's just something I have to stay aware of. Am I a cog or something that's holding back the growth of the business because the business has just outgrown me?

I'm a big sports analogy guy. Whether it's a professional football team, the NBA, or whoever, teams and players outgrow each other. There's a time in their career when they're best for that team and the dynamic of it. That's going to be true for me at some point in time too where I may not be the best leader for the size we're at or the direction we're going. I want to make sure that I'm not causing harm to the success of the company or the team.

It doesn't mean I'll disappear, but it would mean that my role might change. I will still always loved to be heavily involved in the culture and defending those core values, defending the culture, and making sure that every team member's experience is as good as possible.

Brendan: Just to be clear again, what are Spinutech's core values?

Marc: We have four core values. (1) We get better every day. (2) We do the right thing. (3) We over me. (4) We own it. They're all very simple. They're also very actionable. I give examples for each one. There's a lot of subtext to that. It talks about accountability, holding yourself and others accountable, and then also about being curious.

If you've noticed, I use team members, not employees. The we over me is definitely about being a team player and not flat or climbing, not trying to have any gossip or politics in the workplace. We're all just here to do great work with others as a team. I love sports analogies and SEAL Team Six analogies. I use a lot of those in explaining our core values and how those apply to our work day and in our success.

Brendan: I'm going to hold myself back. I can't wait to ask you the normal final question of our interview to find out who's had influence on you in this leadership space. We'll hold that thought until the end of the interview like normal. Tell us a little bit more about the first 30 days. What are some of those other key elements that the new employee experiences?

Marc: The first 30 days, we've talked about the day one. Week one kind of getting them onboarded. One of the things that we do is we have something called GBA, it's the get better A. We're a digital marketing agency, so we allocate most of our strategies to 34 billable hours a week. There are six open hours, and two of those hours every week are for self-development.

One of the things that we like every team member to do is to get certified in the tools and platforms in which they operate on a regular basis. We do a lot with Google. Most every position, it would be nice to know a lot about analytics. There's Google Analytics. They have an easy certification to go through.

A lot of times, we schedule some of those things out. Week two, they can start to do some of those things before they're really ramped up fully with client work. If they'd haven't been certified, it's a great opportunity to dig in and get some of those certifications done and also kind of put that training plan for those first few weeks together to knock any of those out as possible.

There's also a weekly check-in from a different person. It could be their leader, it could be the onboarding person. We also have a person who oversees our culture. She will check in as well. There are different people kind of touching base at the end of each week in that first month to just see how they're going and doing.

We also do a 15-day new hire survey. For us, it gives us a consistent question base that we're asking and then getting that feedback to make sure that we're delivering an appropriate experience.

This is kind of a nice one. At the end of their 30 days, I will send them a written—the old school snail mail—welcome note or thank you note and note of appreciation. The secret sauce to that is not as much—it's important, obviously, that they hear those words from me. Another secret sauce that is back to that bad day. Somebody else is going to see that note—a roommate, a spouse, a parent. Somebody's going to see it. That's going to create quite an impression on them.

When I come home and I say to my wife, man, you won't believe the day I had or I walk out of my office into the kitchen and I say, you won't believe the day I had, oh, it's so bad, it was rough, blah, blah, blah. But then they turn into a defender of Spinutech as well and say, you got that thank you note and I've heard you say all these things. You fill them with positivity. It's just a nice touch point.

For me, it's an easy thing to do. It's fun to write them. I try to personalize them. I don't just write a canned message to everybody. I'll ask their leader, how's it going for so and so? Any initial wins that we can talk about? Those are the things having interact with them a little bit, you can feel their passion or their potential.

I want to make sure to remind them that I think they have a ton of upside here. Embrace this journey with us and you're going to grow a ton and so can we together. I just want to make sure I'm encouraging them to unleash that. Let that out so they can become that best version of themselves. Go to places they didn't think they could is really what ignites that fire if it's starting to come out.

Brendan: How many new employees can you put through this process at any one time?

Marc: I think the most we've had in one new day has maybe six, maybe seven. I would prefer to keep it under five. We've slowed on hiring a little bit. We're just being a little cautious with the economy right now. But when we were really rolling and having large growth years of 30+%, 40%, 50% growth, it does become challenging, soyou have a lot of new people coming in at once.

Honestly, it probably dilutes the experience a little bit. That's why I'd like to space them out to have just a more personalized and higher touch experience. There are benefits to bringing a lot of people in at once too. There's a bond that those individuals create that is a little bit unique, but I like to keep it smaller if we can and try to keep the quality of that experience as high as possible.

Brendan: Have you ever reflected on outside of Spinutech and some of the feedback you hear for the new employees coming in about why other companies may only employ a person every now and again, and it's not a great experience for them why they have trouble creating a great experience for one person, let alone five plus at a time?

Marc: I think for most leaders, most business owners, societally it's really about the dollars. It's about EBITDA. It's about how much dividends are getting paid out. It's more financially driven than it is about the human capital component. Our biggest asset is our team and our people, so I think investing in them is never going to be a bad investment. You'd have a very hard time convincing me otherwise.

I would just tell every leader that it is the number one investment whether you realize it or not. If you're not doing something about this, it would be very shocking to you what the results could turn into because I think sometimes when you try so hard to focus on the dollars and cents side of things, you actually make it worse. If you focus on having a great team, a great experience, producing a great product or service, and just worry about that, from my experience, the dollars and cents side of it has worked itself out.

I don't really like to think about that stuff anyways. I have to as a business owner, but the way I'm wired is more about the team and protecting them, helping them grow, achieving things they didn't think were possible. That's more rewarding to me. That's my currency versus the dollars. My experience has been that the dollars and cents have always worked themselves out in a very positive way when we've stayed focused on the team and their experience.

Brendan: If you had to wrap up that first 30 days from an employee experience, what do you hope they share about their first 30 days at Spinutech with others?

Marc: It would go something like, man, my new job is so amazing, you won't believe it. They did this, they did that. I'm getting to know a lot of people, they're super talented. I'm just so impressed by how kind they are, how talented a lot of those individuals are. It's this passion, it's this excitement, it's validation that they made a great move. They're excited to show up for work the next morning, and just keep kind of attacking each day, each week, each month, and grow with a team.

It's kind of an overall feeling that they maybe have or a tidal wave that just keeps building that they're going to propel forward and really set that tone for the long term journey with us, as opposed to there's a timer, I'm going to get burned out, I'm constantly looking for that next gig. It's that sense of I'm home, I'm where I'm supposed to be, and I'm excited to continue down this path.

Brendan: Let's take that into the next 30-day block, if we could, coming up to 60 days. What are some of the key things that we do with the new employee to make sure that what they've just shared about their first 30 days, which was sensational, keeps on that bandwagon and keeps rolling forward in the right direction?

Marc: A lot of the next day 30 through 90 is focused on their growth. There are still check-ins. There are check-ins with leadership. There are a lot of coffee chats or just virtual chats. It's starting to do more of that training and then really diving into the work, really getting on boarded and turning into a productive team member from a billing perspective, doing great work, learning.

Hopefully they've learned the systems, but learning the clients and the accounts. That's a challenge. We have a lot of clients and a lot of different types of businesses we work with, so just understanding each dynamic. For us, we have some vertical specialties, but it's really the dynamics of each client, the potential politics that that client has internally, how to navigate those, how are we able to produce our best work for that client under whatever circumstances they have internally.

It really starts to dig into that work, but also there are those constant check-ins. There's a 60-day survey again as well to just make sure that we're on track, but it's that constant touch base. I think maybe the theme would be over communicating. We're making sure that somebody is always just checking in. How's it going? Are things as you expected? Is there anything you need that meeting additional people on the executive leadership team?

Hopefully, at that point, there's not an unfamiliar face from leadership's perspective for them. They're starting to hear and know people. I didn't say this earlier, but our goal of that first month is really to get that DNA of our culture and core values injected as quickly as possible. Hopefully, it's starting to really flourish.

By the end of that 100 days, my goal is, are you a defender of the culture? The quicker I can turn you into a defender of the culture, that's the turning point. You can see it with some new team members. I can think of a couple of my head right now that are relatively new. When I met them in person, you can start to feel that.

Even just hearing them on Slack and reading their comments on Slack, we've got a shout out channel which just happens to be all about our core values as well. If you give a shout out, it has to align with one of our core values. It doesn't have to, but it always does.

When they start to drop those in and saying, Brendan really displayed we over me, and his client pitch when blah, blah, blah. You hear them saying that and it's like, oh, yes, they're there, they get it. It's all sunk in. They get it and it's part of who they are now. They're defending it and they're really proud of that.

Not in a coat way, I want to make sure I clarify that. It's in a positive way of, I like the way that this organization thinks, I like the way that they push me, I like their high standards, the high quality of work that they put out. That's a fun thing to be a part of.

People like to win. People like to be part of a winning mentality, as well as just winning in general. Most people don't like to lose. We want that winning mentality as part of the team to really sink in and turn that corner for them.

Brendan: It sounds like there would be tons and tons of shares through that Slack channel. Is there one that particularly stands out for you over the years?

Marc: The latest one is always the best one. In the last two weeks, we've had some major clients. Some of our clients have been in town or we've gone and seen them. It's presented some great opportunities for some team members that are really starting to flourish and blossom.

I personally sat in on a couple of these situations. Halfway through those meetings and both of the situations I'm thinking of, there was this sense of pride and just joy for those individuals of, they're really talented. It's exciting to witness the greatness that they're producing, the way that they're talking, and the confidence that they have in it. Just that reflection of where they started, where they're at now. That's a reflection of the team around them, how they've pushed them, shared that knowledge, and really had them grow.

Just last week, I got a Slack from somebody that said, hey, would you mind giving me a comment about so and so? I know you'd set some things verbally, but would you write it out? They captured five different Slacks where that person in the meeting had gotten those, complimenting that person on their team.

This leader posted that back screenshot of those in the Slack channel, and it's just great. Again, pride, joy, and not pride for me, it's pride for them and the team of what they've accomplished together. Those are just always super fun.

Brendan: You've mentioned check-in a number of times, the weekly check-ins through the 30, 60 days, and I'm sure beyond an ongoing. Can you tell us a little bit about what a normal check-in would look like? What's involved?

Marc: We leave some flexibility there. It's going to be a little bit different for each leader. Some core things that I look at is, I think right now, it's really important to say, how are you doing? I don't want the easy answer because a lot of people just say, oh, yeah, I'm good. We're all not good right now. It's been a tough couple of years.

Life, work, and everything's just been more stressful than it used to be. It's really saying, hold on, how are you doing? Let's just be human first, try to tear down some of those walls, and really make sure that is there anything that's holding you back professionally or personally that I can help you with to be the best you are right now? If you can get past that, that's really, I think—I'll say it this way. We need to be leaders of humans first and then leaders of the work that they produce second.

People need that leadership on a human side way more right now, where we're at. I'd say it's going to be the tone for quite a while. How are you doing in that project? Did you get it done? I think you can do this better. It's more just let's connect human first and build that relationship. That really allows us to then have a deeper conversation from work perspective as well.

I love the saying, attack the problem, not the person. If there is in that check-in something that we need to correct, let's put that problem on the table, let's both stare at it, and then go, all right, how do we fix that problem? Now it makes the person giving that feedback, we're focused on that problem. The person receiving it, it's not feeling like it's about them or me. They can solve that problem together.

Again, I'll go back to the core values. In that check-in, if there's something misaligned, okay, let's talk about what core value is that misaligned with? Okay, now let's talk about why that's misaligned, and then let's talk about how we get it back on the rails and no longer misaligned. It gives a really simple framework for solving those problems or overcoming a misalignment that feels less personal and as an attack.

I think the thing I was stressed with this question is, it's just, let's be human first, make sure that we're connecting there, and solving anything that needs to be cleared up there before we dive into the hardcore work stuff.

Brendan: One of the things about the process is there are always failure points and putting checks and balances in place, potential failure points. Once again, I know there's lots of stuff you've spoken about, but is there anything in that first 75+ days, including the pre-employment or the pre-turn up, that is just a no failure point, we just cannot allow this part of the process to fail at any point in time?

Marc: Maybe late last year, we had an onboarding for a couple of new people started at the same time. This individual, they were disengaged in my cultural onboarding. They were skipping a lot of the other onboarding meetings. I was very alarmed by that. If that is breaking down on week one, it's over. There's clearly a misalignment on how we view the world and how they would view it.

I would just go back to that engagement. If engagement is not there, we need to pull that cord as quickly as possible. It's going to be better for both of us, because they're clearly not going to be happy in our environment where we care deeply about those things, and we're not going to be happy with them because they don't care about those things. It's just a misalignment.

We can just basically agree to disagree on that. It doesn't make them a bad person, it just means that, hey, we just view the world a little bit differently. You're going to be way more successful going someplace else as quickly as possible. Let's work towards making that happen as painless as possible.

Brendan: Looking back at that experience, was there anything in hindsight, a wonderful thing, that stood out that maybe we missed in the early part of the process?

Marc: Yeah. Speaking to that example, the particular role, it's a harder personality at times, or maybe a little bit more reserved for the role that we were looking for. It just tends to be the nature of what that role or personality looks like.

I made a comment to that leader like, listen, I'm going to trust you on this. I don't have a great read from a cultural perspective just because they didn't say a whole lot. I don't know if they were disengaged, didn't care, or if they're just a little bit more reserved and more of an introvert, so I don't want to dock them because of that. That might just be their personality, and that's okay. It doesn't mean they couldn't be successful here.

If I was going to judge it based on my interaction, I'd be a no go. But if you guys feel good about it, if you feel like they're a good fit, if you feel like, technically, they have the skills that we need, then sure, let's go.

In retrospect, they probably should have maybe said, hey, I've got a bad feeling about a cultural fit here. Did you feel that? Well, yeah, I did. What does that mean? Do we have a re-interview for that and just say, hey, we're nervous about are you aligned with us and our core values? And maybe sending them a note saying, we'd love for you to make sure you've reviewed our core values and just think through, how do you feel about those?

I never want to say like, do you align? Of course it'd be oppressive. Yes, I align. But trying to pull out of them asking in several different ways to make sure that we are aligned. Slow to hire, fast to fire. It's a simple rule, but we probably, in that situation, just maybe got a little, I don't know if lazy is the right word or just needed to solve a problem.

It's going to happen, but maybe we're a little slow to fix that problem once we identified it as well. Absolutely, I think you're going to have a few misses here and there, especially if you're hiring at a higher volume. You've just got to know, if you know you made a mistake, you got to fix it very quickly.

Brendan: Yeah, absolutely. Let's keep with the sports analogies, mate. Let's go to the back end of the game, those final 30 days or the last part of the 115-day process. What does that look like? What's critical in that time?

Marc: It's really just, again, staying engaged. Really, are you settled in? Do you have everything you need? Do you feel like you're in the right role? Are you getting the support that you need? Are you connected to the people you need to?

One of the things I like to say is, do you know who to ask the questions to? You don't need to know everything, but you need to know who to ask. At that point, they should know who to ask and have built those relationships. At that six month point, I do another check in with them where a group will come together and they're celebrating their six-month anniversary.

It's just a, hey, how's it going? Has the first six months been all you thought it would be? Is there anything that we could do better? I would love that feedback. You listen to anything that they might say, but most of the time they are like, you know what, I'm loving it. I appreciate everything that the team put into that first 100 days, in my first six months. I'm excited.

We do poll surveys. I just read one a few weeks ago that said, I hope I retire here. They've been in the system for about six months. You think, man, that's a pretty big compliment. Clearly, they've had some bad experiences in the past and understand a great culture when they see it. Obviously, they're a defender at this point. They want to make sure it stays this way and that they don't let somebody else come in and make that bad change.

Brendan: What you're really saying, if I can take away from that, is that it's more of the same. More of the stuff you've done in the 15 days before they walk in the door, more of the stuff of the first 30 days, more of the stuff for the next 30 days, which makes 60. The more of the stuff in that back half or that back end of the game up to the 100 days. Do you stop at 100+ days? How do you treat them after that?

Marc: No, we do not stop. Absolutely not. We've refer to this as Spinutech 100-course level as that onboarding process, and then it goes to 101, 201, 301. It's really just getting into that ongoing cadence of annual review, check-ins, the training, the GBA to get better, eight hours. Just making sure that they're taken care of, their needs are met, they have everything they need to.

A lot of times, it's also developing a career path plan. What does their growth trajectory look like? We have a lot of things outlined as far as, okay, here's the role that you're in and what the expectations are. If you want to get to a different position or a different title, here's the types of things you need to be doing. We try to make that as no subjectivity to it as possible.

It's hard to do that, but really try to just help make sure that their growth is pushing them towards the right direction to take on a bigger role. Do they want to be a leader of people? Do they want to be a silent leader? Do they want to be a labeled leader? What do they want to be a leader at all? Just make sure that we've got that path for them to seek growth.

Self-development and a career path for growth is very important to almost every new team member coming in at this stage in the game. That's what people care about a lot. We want to make sure we're addressing that very clearly, as opposed to making it a little bit blind or not spoken about. Let's just make it right out there in the open, be very clear, and shoot. The more people that get promoted within, the better. That's a great, great thing to have happened.

Brendan: Unfortunately, I would say you are not unique as far as leadership goes, but you're in the minority. These experiences are not common, unfortunately. Why are you a minority? Why is this mindset? What's your view on why this mindset is a minority?

Marc: One thing that's a little bit interesting about my past is we always joke, we never work for the man. We didn't go into corporate America, so we weren't stained by some of the traditional leadership mentalities. Those early years are your informative years. That's one component of it.

I would say my partners and I, we've always cared about the team. I don't know if that's because of the way we started. We were shoulder to shoulder with everybody or in the trenches doing the work, winning, losing, failing, learning, growing, all the ups and downs we've felt together. When you're that close to everybody, you have that responsibility of making sure that paycheck is there for the 1st team member, the second, the 20th, the 50th, and so on.

You worry about that less as time goes on. I think just going back to that founder mentality, for me, I don't think that's ever gone away. I still maybe have some of those fears or concerns. That drives you to make sure you're taking care of that team. I don't know. It could be the way that we're wired. It's just the way we are, I guess.

To us, this is like common sense, but I know that that's not the truth. I didn't always know that. A lot of times, when you do bring on a new team member, you hear these stories. Actually, we joke about it, it's like somebody that's come from a bad relationship. You have to do some rewiring, get them to think differently, and not have those self-doubts or fears of bringing up things to leadership because they're going to get in trouble or they're going to get yelled at.

I've never yelled at anybody in this organization, never. I've never denied anybody a PTO. All the things that you hear about in other places just don't happen here. That takes sometimes a while for people to build that trust and understand that the scars from their past unfortunately won't rear their heads here, so get that feeling of freedom.

Again, be the best version of yourself. I just want to help uncork that as quickly as possible and so does every other leader here. We all want those same things, but unfortunately, there's not a lot of that out there. I would go back to the greed, the money side of it.

A lot of people with businesses, they get so focused on that because that's the scoreboard. If you need somebody who owns a business, that's one of the first things people kind of wonder or want to know. To me, that's not the true scoreboard. I don't believe we're put on this earth just to work. I don't believe we're put on this just to earn money.

I think that the experience you can have from eight to five with the other people, whether they're with you for a year or 20 years, I feel it's my responsibility to make that as best as possible. Let's have some fun, let's do some really great work, and be proud of that. The other stuff will figure itself out.

Brendan: I think it's a great time for me to ask you what is normally our final question, and that is, who or what has had the greatest influence on your leadership journey?

Marc: I've gotten this question before. I think most people have one person, but I would say for me it's been a ton of people. It's taking little nuggets from a lot of people throughout the journey.

In college, when I was working for the random small jobs, hourly stuff, it was more looking at the managers that I had. Because of those jobs were high turnover, you didn't have great managers. I probably picked up on what I didn't like and what I wouldn't do if I were a leader, so kind of filing those things away.

You do meet some really great people, great leaders, great business owners. I was fortunate I had some of those that were maybe towards the end of their career when I was really young in my career. You just witnessed it and you maybe start to ask some questions.

I've always tried to set up lunches with people and the various communities which we operate in that I've admired from a distance. Sometimes I'll just reach out and say, hey, I know we don't really know each other, but can I buy you lunch? Here's my goal. I just want to learn from you. I just want to understand your journey, what you value as a leader, and how you solve problems.

I joined YPO about four years ago, the Young Presidents Organization. It's a global leadership organization. That has been unreal for me in my journey because you're connected to other leaders of businesses that are like-size or bigger. Any problem you have, somebody's already had it. They've already solved it, they've got the solution for you. Just getting connected in that community has been really great.

I'm in a couple of different forums that meet monthly, ones with an international one. We have a gentleman from the Dominican Republic and a gentleman from Canada. The rest of us are from the US.

We meet monthly and we're all agency owners. That's awesome because you don't get to talk to other agencies, so that's very industry related, but then I have a local forum in the state of Iowa where I live, unrelated businesses. I love those guys like brothers. We talk about personal stuff because as a leader, it's kind of lonely at the top.

Those individuals in those circles have been such a great support system for me. In good times and bad times, they're a phone call away, a text message away, and the same for me to them. One of my buddies in that group says, we're gas can buddies. No matter how far you are away, if I run out of gas, I know I can call you and you're going to bring that gas can to me. It's a really simple way of stating just how deep that relationship goes.

It's really a combination of a lot of different things and people across the time that have been supportive. Obviously, my wife has been a great sounding board for 22+ years in the business, which was before we were married. It's just that culmination of a lot of relationships and a lot of different groups that have really been a great help for me.

Brendan: You've shared so much good stuff, you guys, and you being the ultimate leader and the team doing so much great stuff at Spinutech. We know that none of us are perfect. Can you share a moment where you have been maybe disappointed in yourself as a leader in Spinutech and what you did about that?

Marc: I think we all have more self doubt than we ever want to admit. There's been countless times where I was like, man, was that the best thing to do? Did I react the right way? Am I over sensitive about some of the cultural stuff at times? Possibly.

I think anytime I feel like I've missed steps trying to own it as quickly as possible, if you realize it. We went through a merger about a year and a half ago. Some of the new team members are interacting with them. There was an individual in leadership and we worked very closely together. It was our first disagreement. I realized my tone was maybe a little bit off and just saying, all right, listen, I know I wasn't my best in this situation. I know you weren't your best, we both weren't. Let's just get that on the table.

Actually, we had a really great conversation. I said at the end of it, hey, this is groundbreaking. Even though we had this bad thing happen because both of us weren’t our best, we just broke through, and let's make sure we focus on that. Reminding this individual a week later of, hey, I'm glad we had that happen.

Any good relationship, you're going to have a point. We're all human and man, being human, will disappoint you given enough time. Every human being will disappoint you given enough time, so just recognizing that and owning it.

I tell the team, listen, I'm not perfect. We've all got to be the TSA. See something, say something. Challenge me, give me that feedback. I want to be the best leader for you as possible.

I do a weekly video. Every Friday, I send out a video to the team. It's short, it's two, three minutes. It's oftentimes a little bit of encouragement, some updates, and things like that.

Back in May, I believe I just sent out a video saying, we all need to give each other permission to get feedback. I want you all to know, all 165 of you, that I am giving you permission to give me feedback. I hope you will do the same to your teammates so that everybody is comfortable, whether that's good feedback or not good feedback, to provide that.

I would say what I've learned over time is just that mindset of you're not attacking me, I messed up, I'm human. We're all going to mess up. Give me that feedback and I want to get better from it.

I ask a lot of people that I interact with on a regular basis. Hey, do you think you could give me pointers on what I could be doing better? Is there a weakness that I'm blind to? Did that come across okay? Was that too harsh?

Setting that tone from a leadership perspective that I'm vulnerable and open to that, that's going to make the team around you the same way. That's been a learned thing over 22+ years.

Brendan: Marc, from our conversation today, it sounds like you are a fantastic defender of the culture. It sounds like you know it is your number one goal and your number one task as the leader of Spinutech. Congratulations on what you're doing.

Thank you very much for sharing what you've shared with our audience today. It's been a pleasure talking to someone like you and a leader like you with that mindset. Thanks for being a fantastic guest on The Culture of Things podcast.

Marc: Thank you very much. This is a great conversation, fun to talk about, and easy to talk about. I appreciate the great questions and having me on your show.

Brendan: Absolute pleasure, buddy.

Do you want to retire at your company? Are you happy, even excited to go to work each day? Do you feel your needs are being met, you’re growing, and developing in your role? If you said yes to any of these questions, unfortunately, you’re in the minority.

As you’ve heard, Marc is focused on creating this experience at Spinutech. He wants his team to have their needs met. He wants them to grow and develop. He wants them to have true work life balance. And above all, he wants them to be defenders of the culture.

The first 100+ days for a new employee sets the tone. What experience are you creating for your new employees?

These were my three key takeaways from my conversation with Marc.

My first key takeaway, Leaders are defenders of the culture. Hiring, firing, leading, managing, and solving problems all revolve around culture and the core values. Injecting the DNA of the culture and core values into new employees is a critical first step. Before a new employee walks in the door they know the culture and values of Spinutech. This sets the foundation for leaders to be defenders of the culture.

My second key takeaway, Leaders get better every day. They cringe if they hear the phrase ‘that’s how we’ve always done it!’ Their mindset is focused on self-improvement and being the best version of themselves. Also helping others to be the best version of themselves. Leaders set the example by getting better every day.

My third key takeaway, Leaders treat people as their currency. Their actions every day reflect it. They think about the team, protect them, grow them, and help them achieve things they didn’t think was possible. Focusing on and investing in people is their number one priority. They know by doing this, the dollars look after themselves. Leaders always treat people as their currency.

In summary, my three key takeaways were, Leaders are defenders of the culture, Leaders get better every day, Leaders treat people as their currency.

What were your key takeaways from the interview? Let me know at thecultureofthings.com, on YouTube, or via our socials.

Thanks for joining me. Remember, the best outcome is on the other side of a genuine conversation.

Outtro (music): Thank you for listening to The Culture of Things podcast with Brendan Rogers. Please visit thecultureofleadership.com to access the show notes. If you love The Culture of Things podcast, please subscribe, rate and give a review on Apple podcasts and remember a healthy culture is your competitive advantage.